Jude O'Reilly on the Functional Tennis Podcast

Jude O'Reilly

Off-court Performance Gains

Episode 59

We are joined by Jude O'Reilly, a performance coach that has many years of experience working with top professional athletes.

We talk about the transition from the junior game to the professional circuit & about how players can improve on court by using and optimising off-court techniques.

By listening to the episode, you will truly start to understand how aspects of daily life can affect performance 😏

 

If you find it interesting please share with your tennis friends and family.

Thanks to our sponsors HEAD who allow us to have a producer and a better sounding podcast 🙏


Follow Jude on Twitter

https://twitter.com/judeoreilly

 

Episode Transcription

Jude O'Reilly : 

Hi, I'm Jude O'Reilly and you're listening to the Functional Tennis Podcast.

 

Fabio Molle : 

Welcome to Episode 59 of the Functional Tennis Podcast. This week I speak to Jude O'Reilly, an ex tour golf caddy, who's now a personal performance advisor. We talk about the challenge in transition from the junior to adult game, managing stress, dealing with emotions, living healthier, and much more. I've spoken to Jude quite a bit over the past few years and always learn something that can help me improve on and off the court. Let me know your thoughts on the episode after over at our Instagram account (functionaltennispodcast) or over at our new Twitter account, @functennis. Here we go. Hi, Jude. Welcome to the Functional Tennis Podcast.

 

Jude O'Reilly : 

Thanks, Fabio. Good to be here with you today.

 

Fabio Molle : 

It's great to have you on. I think I was telling you about this podcast before we launched maybe it's actually a year ago. And I was like I'm launching a podcast - need to get you on. And eventually it's taken a year. So I'm really excited to have you on. And maybe to get us started, you can tell our listeners a little bit about yourself how you got to become who you are today.

 

Jude O'Reilly : 

Sure. Thank you. Yes, well, we've had a couple of interesting chats before on all areas of performance or many areas of performance, my background and where I'm coming from. I studied commerce in UCD in Dublin and took a different turn to most of my classmates. After we finished, two weeks after my final exams, I was working as a golf caddy on the European golf tour for one of Ireland's top golfers at the time, Christy O'Connor Jr. And I think I just wanted to do something different. I wanted to travel the world a little bit and had luckily gotten to know Christie for a little while and he suggested going out on tour. So that's what I did and what was meant to be a few months or maybe a year turned into 12 and a half years working on the European tour, Australian, New Zealand golf tour, then up to Japan and a few years on the US tour also. So yeah, one year turned into 12 full time and pretty much 25 plus years of caddying for some of the top golfers in the world and in Japan I was very lucky that working with some of their top golfers. Because I was with one of their top golfers, I got to spend a lot of time with the very top golfers that came to visit Japan at the end of the year. So I got to know the likes of Seve Ballesteros, Nick Faldo - have dinner with him and spent some time with him and then did a little bit of work with him after that, and Greg Norman and others. So it was a wonderful introduction and I was very lucky to get so much time one on one with top players in their field. And during that time I started thinking about what was the difference then between the good, the very good, and the great, and start to explore and that sent me on an ongoing journey and path which I'm still on looking for the secrets in inverted commas. There are no real secrets, but we go searching after all of the different areas that can/may help and try and avoid and look to avoid the pitfalls as well.

 

Fabio Molle : 

And you haven't figured out yet what makes the great so great, you know a few things that make them great?

 

 

Jude O'Reilly : 

Well, there will be some commonalities across those that have been successful, whether it be in golf, in sports, or in business or in other areas, and some of it will come down to it may appear like confidence and self belief, and they will be important ingredients. But often they will have been things that have been trained as opposed to having people born with them. So, as I say, there will be commonalities - very few people have gotten to high places without putting in effort, work and attention to detail and also without somebody else giving them some guidance, whether it be a parent or a parent initially and then a good coach. It doesn't have to be all bells and whistles. But getting some good basic stuff right and working and moving forward on that.

 

Fabio Molle : 

That will leave us into nice area here where we briefly touched on the other day, where we talk about the challenges for tennis players from moving from top juniors, they may be top juniors in their country or in the world to move into the senior game and some of them decide to go pro straightaway, some decide to go to college and mature that way. But ultimately, just because you're a top Junior doesn't mean you're going to be a top senior and you have some good thoughts into this which I think would be great to share.

 

Jude O'Reilly : 

It's probably highlighted maybe in the likes of tennis, golf, there's a longer timeframe for playing the game. So there is maybe as much pressure to get onto the course or onto the court quite as quickly. And there are some difficulties with having being top in a small pool or a small area in terms of your local environment. And there are some wonderful benefits obviously to that as well because if you can't make it to the top in your own area, what are your chances of making it to the top in a bigger pool with more competition, but at the same time, you can get used to winning, which then you won't get as much of maybe in a bigger pool with bigger fish and tougher competition. And that's something where certainly a lot of golfers have experienced difficulty on in their home country - they might have been getting a lot of wins, getting a lot of top fives a lot of top 10s whatever was normal for them to be in the hunt in contention in almost every tournament that they play in. And then suddenly if they go internationally, there are a lot of other similar players to themselves and maybe better players with more experience that are rising above them. So that transition having been a champion, or a big fish in a small pool to suddenly a small fish in a big pool is something that really has potential to take some people down and turn them off, they don't get the same. I talked to players a lot about what I call the event injection for a golfer when they get the score card in their hand. It's like an injection of different chemicals flowing around your system. And how you create and react to those new juices that are in your system will be a big determinant test how well you're going to do so other influences with people growing up. And again, I think in golf and tennis there are a lot of overlap and similarities. Most will tend to have a dominant personality in their early years growing up whether it be a dominant or a strong parent. A dominant or strong coach that helps and leads them and maybe pushes them to a certain extent as well and helps them to get better and to help them to learn to push themselves. But there's an important transition then that has to take place. And if that strength of character isn't developed within the athlete, or if it doesn't shift from the parent or the person to the athlete, then there's the setting up for a tough ride ahead and what could be not very favorable outcomes potentially for the person that may not get enjoyment. For me, fun has to be high on the list of what you're doing at all times. It doesn't mean that you're laughing and smiling all the time. You can get fun and enjoyment by putting in a hard day's session in the gym or a hard day's work, practicing. That can be fun, but it's got to be your fun and that's got to be there as an athlete. And where I've seen parents where they've been very strong and wonderful and definitely a lot of athletes will not have got to the level they're at without perhaps a strong parent. But at the same time, if that transition doesn't take place, and it moves that the athlete has strength, and they own their progress from there on that they become responsible for that. That's a recipe for disaster.

 

Fabio Molle : 

And how does that transition happen? Does it just happens naturally? Or what can parents do? What can strong parents do to help put the power in their kids?

 

Jude O'Reilly : 

Sometimes it'll happen naturally. And other times it will need to be managed and controlled. And it can be difficult for a parent, because they're always, you know, at the end of the day, they're doing what they feel is best for the child. And they may be looking at, well, this is the way I've always done it. And I've always helped them in this way. And they've done well with this. So I should continue, but it's not always the case of what's got me here is going to get me to the next level. What's got you here won't get you to the next level, necessarily.

 

Fabio Molle : 

What would you recommend is it would it be stuff like sending your kid to like a new country where they go and train in new environment, and they sort of have to learn how to be by themselves? Maybe they have a new mentor, or kids maybe if they've strong parents, if they go to college where the kids are away from the parents, or the coach, if I'm if I've a young kid, and I'm really a strong, dominant parent, and I know it's an issue, and I've listened to your podcast, and I say, Jude, can you come over? Can we talk? What do you tell a parent?

 

Jude O'Reilly :

If you think back to when you help your child first walk, you don't want them to fall, you want to hold on to them, you want to hold their hand all the time. If you do that, guaranteed it will take them a lot longer to walk. So there has to be a release of power. So like you suggested there, yes, potentially you expose them to new environments, let them go and do their own thing as some of it could be even just outside of the sport initially, that they go to develop themselves as a person, because at the end of the day, there is nobody on any court that is not a person first, and then a player second. So let them develop their own personality, their own sense of self and who they are and bring that into their game. So they become more mature as a person. College is a great way of doing that. It's not necessarily for everybody, and it depends on where they're at. But it certainly will be wonderful if somebody has a chance to go to college and to explore and develop their sport while studying and in college and learning about life and looking after themselves and doing all of that in quite a still controlled scenario, then great, they're still protected. It's not a case of throwing them into a dangerous situation. But gentle exposure to new environments will challenge. The comfort zone has to be moved and moved out gently and gradually all the time for growth and development.

 

Fabio Molle : 

Interesting. Have you seen these younger adults, let's say that are just moving out of their teenage years. It's the mature ones. It's the ones who know themselves who do a lot better?

 

 

Jude O'Reilly : 

Certainly, in terms of longevity of top class performance, most definitely. It's those who have matured, and even from an early stage, those that can handle themselves in different situations. At the end of the day, they're the ones that have to be doing it. They've got to be the ones standing up and performing day in and day out. They're also the ones that have to be strong enough to at the end of the day, to look back on the result, good or bad and process it. Their parents may process it in a certain way, their coach in another way. But really, what's most important is the way they process what has just happened is going to determine how well they move forward and prepare for next event, the next day. And there have have been tests done and studies done particularly in tennis where one of the biggest differentiators between the good and the better players was what happened in between the points. So what I call the space or the gap, and that would be exaggerated in golf because we have more time in between our hopefully more time in between hitting one shot and hitting the next shot, you've got time to walk, think, process, and you've got time for the little voice in your head to start either knocking you or building you up and preparing you for the next shot.

 

Fabio Molle :

How do you deal with those voices? We all get them and I'm sure the better guys just know how to control them move on think positively. What sort of training can somebody do to help improve those voices in their head?

 

Jude O'Reilly : 

So there are only three things that we can train, we can train the body, the craft, and the mind and most people are looking after the body pretty well. The craft then through the technique that's been well looked after and well documented, but the mind is the area probably that even though there is more and more attention being brought to it, there's still a lot of room for improvement there. So yes, everybody has voices, a voice or voices in their head. And that's the first thing to admit and acknowledge that and also to realize that it's normal to have a voice. It's also normal for that voice to be negative, we have what's called a negativity bias that's to protect ourselves and for purposes of survival, we have to pay attention to the things that are negative because one negative thing that happens historically, when in more primitive times that was likely to kill us. Whereas one positive thing getting a meal or getting some food yesterday was wonderful and great and beneficial, but it didn't quite balance off one negative on one positive. So we do have a negativity bias in built into us and that is natural and normal. How some people are better at it than others. A lot will come down to their upbringing, things that are said to them or not said to them giving them space to form their own opinions, this can be a good thing at the same time, a little bit of guidance towards them being positive and reacting in a positive way towards something that I'll say in inverted commas would be deemed to be potentially negative. Nobody arises without having gone through some tough times, nobody wins every point. Nobody wins every match. Nobody wins every game. So how do you react? Do you come back stronger? Or does it weaken you? So some best practice some good will come down to you can do mindfulness training. You and I have spoken before about biofeedback, that's something that I would use quite a bit of and encourage people to use for their training where you can take a look at what your internal state is like. You can also pay attention to other variables which will affect the quality of your state, and in turn, the quality of your of your mind and its ability to operate and process things at a particular time. So sleep is something that I've monitored, have been monitoring for many years myself, almost every single night continuously since 2013, up to three devices. So I see what's happening, I'm bringing attention to it and more and more golfers and tennis players, as well, all athletes really are paying more and more attention to it now, which is great. It's good that more focus is on that because that plays a huge part. It plays a huge part in recovery for the body, but also for the mind. So for mental health, as well as mental strength, extremely important to be paying attention to sleep. Ability to focus - when you mentioned young people there so I would work with a reasonable number of young people. And I would ask them is focus and concentration important to their game and to their performance? And, of course, yes, definitely. It is Jude, of course. But yet many young people will practice distraction for a lot of their free time on their phones flicking quickly through different things as opposed to trying to get their focus just on one element or one thing. So with some of the biofeedback that I would do that's where you can gain some strength in that area, you can see what your internal state is like. And you can bring your attention just to one thing, which be regulating the breath is something that we all have with us all the time. And if we can learn to bring our attention to that, I'm sure in tennis, there would be examples, but the likes of Michael Phelps (in swimming). An interesting story about when he had an operation. The doctor came to him after the operation. Michael was keen and anxious to get going and to get home. And the doctor said, well, I can't let you out. Now it will probably take about 24 hours. I want to wait until your heart rate your resting heart rate gets down below 50. It's currently 85. And Michael said, Oh, Doc, sorry. What did you say? So when I get my resting heart rate under 50, I can go? And the Dr. nodded. Yes. He said, Okay, we'll just, you know, hang on a second. Give me a moment. And he closed his eyes and within a minute he was down under 50. And the doctor looked at it okay, well, yeah, okay. I'll let you go now. That was it. He had been practicing and controlling taking control of his internal state, and was able to regulate his heart rate within a very, very short space of time and move on. But this is something that some players like that are bringing attention to. So more and more people are looking at biofeedback, I think there will be an announcement in tennis shortly where heart rate is going to be monitored during games. So that's something that's I think that'll probably be something said on that even within a few weeks. So currently, yes, people would be paying attention to that in practice, but I think that's something that's going to be coming up more to the fore shortly. And the reason for that is to monitor physical health and then physical as well as mental health as well as an area that people would be looking at and doing that monitoring for.

 

Fabio Molle : 

I think that's exciting. Also from a spectators point of view and it is something I've actually always wanted if you're watching tennis on TV, where you can see players heart rate, it's like matchpoint semifinals. They've never got to a final before. And you know exactly, you can see exactly what's going on with their heart and saying, god, that's how tough it gets. Because once the heart rate goes up, you sort of you lose control and the mind is wandering, and you're getting ahead of yourself. So it's the guys who can really control that. And as you said, do the training and the ones who are working towards that.

 

Jude O'Reilly :

Well, I would pause you or put you back slightly on that when the heart rate goes up, it doesn't necessarily mean that you lose control, you can still keep rhythm with your heart rate at a higher heart rate. And that's where some of the key is, so an incoherent heart rate, then you start to lose control. And when emotions also get high, that's when you don't have access to all of your brain. But you can still keep coherence and keep rhythm within your heart rate at a higher or at a lower level. It's easier at a lower level. But with practice, you can also do that at a higher level. I think it's it's either the Belgian or the Dutch police force that would be trained in this so that then they can cope better in a stressful situation so that they can firstly, be in a better state in the stressful situation. And also, when the stressful situation is over, that they can recover and get out of it quicker. So in the likes of tennis, you're not going to be expecting to be in a low heart rate state as you're playing a game, the heart rate will be high. So can you cope with this? And what are you going to do at that heart rate? Can you still keep a rhythm while at that higher level? And in between the points or in between shots? Can you have micro or mini recoveries then as well? How quick can you bring it back? Can you be like Michael Phelps and get it back down very quickly within a very short space of time? And the mind and the physical - they both play a part in that it's not just about the mind. It's a combination of and hydration, nutrition. And as I said sleep as well also have input into that.

 

Fabio Molle : 

It's a big combination. You're right. I used to think that people would ask getting healthy, you know getting in good shape, how much of it is gym work and you know, before I taught 70% is eating 30% is actually in the gym or on court. Now this is more from a healthy perspective, not let's say performance, tennis performance or weightlifting. But only more recently, I know you've been big on tracking sleep. I have probably been tracking for about two years myself with Oura ring, which I find is great. I don't know how accurate they are. But it gives a good baseline. But I think that the equation, sleep is over 50% of it because you're not sleeping well. Every decision you make is not your best decision because you're always looking for a cheat really. Would you agree with that?

 

Jude O'Reilly : 

Yes. So I've given a couple of talks, which I entitled apps, and after everybody's got apps on their phones. You've got an app with your Oura ring. So everybody's got apps, everybody's familiar with that. So I use that acronym just to, to make it easy to remember, the A in this case would be a double A, it would be attitude, and awareness. And then the P's would be perspective, preparation, and that leading to success being a small s as a byproduct of the rest. But when you look into awareness and attitude, sleep and state play a big part in that it's hard to feel good and have a good attitude, or even to be aware of your feelings because we tend to get drawn along by our emotions, as opposed to directing our emotions at our actions and intentions. So bringing awareness to that, but if the sleep isn't good enough, then our state is not very good. You know what it's like at the extremities. If you have for travel reasons or some other reason you've had to do an all nighter or get up at 3:30 am or 4 o'clock in the morning, get out to the airport for a flight not that we're doing as much of that these days, but you'll know what it's like to be sleep deprived? And it is a torture. And it is not good and especially with young kids, that could be a torturous thing too. So it's sleep has got to be given respect and attention. And the way I would bring this to, you know, maybe young people don't really realize that and I can understand that I'm sure I didn't myself give us as much attention or care and it was kind of a macho thing as well about all I only need four and a half or five or six hours sleep, whatever. And very, very few people in the world can operate well or anywhere close to their best on very low sleep. And yes, certainly any of us can get away with it for certain periods of time. So much happens at night when you're asleep. From a performance perspective, you will be replaying your practice and your game during the day. So, I would say to golfers, well, if 80% of shots were good shots, you know, how would you feel? Well, I'd be super confident, be great. Well, you can use your sleep to actually gain and increase that percentage of good shots that are happening. You can set things up at night that during your sleep you're going to be dreaming about and you will be replaying practice and any new techniques or other things you're doing. If you're not giving yourself enough time and good quality sleep, you won't be getting the benefits of that.

 

Fabio Molle : 

What do you mean Jude by setting it up? Is it just doing all you can to get a good night's sleep your preparation or is there something I'm missing here?

 

Jude O'Reilly : 

Well, the first part is setting up for good night's sleep and then the second you can do some visualization work closer to sleep time, which then will be taken into the sleep. So quite a few writers or poets, even famous writers that are current and past, they would not finish a sentence maybe or a chapter before going to bed, they would start something and then let it run because the mind then would be doing some work during the night while asleep, being creative and producing something to add to it. So you can start to embed, and you can start with visualizing how you want to be and how you want to be on the court, off the court and start setting up that story and then let that continue through the night.

 

Fabio Molle : 

That takes me back to days where I was studying to be a software engineer and you get stuck in a problem and you wouldn't hang on it for too long. But you may get on the bus and go somewhere and you'd be traveling on the bus and all of a sudden the solution would come there we can get away from it. And it's interesting what you say about the novelists who they won't finish a paragraph.

 

Jude O'Reilly : 

Yes, they will often not finish a paragraph or a chapter they'll maybe start when as a result, or if they have finished one. If they feel like finishing one, they might finish that, but then they'll start the next one. So they'll write the first sentence of the next and then let that formulate overnight.

 

Fabio Molle :

That's great. That's really good. And tell me so if I am a 16 year old, serious about my sport, tennis in this case, but we know it applies to any sport, what tools do I need in my life, so you know, so I can get to the event injection part and be mentally prepared. So I don't let my emotions get involved. Maybe you can get control of your emotions more easily. What are the different tools I need to set up in my life?

 

Jude O'Reilly :

Well make sure that your life is structured that you do value sleep, which we're talking about, that you have people around you that you can talk to, that you can be honest with people that will be honest with you. That's something that's very important to many people have just people to try and boost their confidence and I say boost in inverted commas there because it may give a short term gain. But long term, there won't be a gain, it can be even detrimental. Because it can be false as opposed to really strong. I sometimes use the example of an egg, a raw egg versus a hard boiled egg. And for both, the skin may crack under pressure, but one you're left with a big mess, the other still solid on the inside. And it takes a little bit of time in hot water in some difficult situations and some time to prepare it to get inside solid. So that can be done on and off the course. A 16 year old can practice decision making when they go into a restaurant when they're doing anything they can practice and prepare their ability to make a decision that they will be happy and committed with. They can do that at any time during the day. There'll be lots of opportunities for it. So they can be helping their on court performance right throughout the day. So lots of different areas and what you mentioned a moment ago about getting on the bus and freeing yourself up. Well, a lot of tennis players will have heard of Tim Gallwey, who's written the Inner Game of Tennis and I was fortunate enough to get to spend a reasonable amount of time and I've kept in touch with with him a little bit since then he has a formula which I like, which is the outcome, our performance is equal to potential minus interference. The potential aspect is something that we're always working to increase by getting our bodies stronger, improving our craft, the interference is something that also we should be looking at reducing, because a lot of players will move through their careers and they will improve their potential, they will have better bodies, it will be much better at their craft and they will make progress, they will move up, but if they're not dealing with the interference, they're not moving up nearly as well or as high as they could be moving.

 

Fabio Molle :

It just sounds like a lot of us, including myself here. don't concentrate enough on mind training. As you said, you can work on the other things - come more natural to us. But we work on the craft, we work on the body, but we don't give enough time to the mind.

 

Jude O'Reilly :

And a lot of people don't know where to start. That's that's part of the problem. And that's why I like to introduce mindfulness meditation to people. Mindfulness is potentially more powerful than meditation. Some people may argue different, but mindfulness is kind of like meditation in action, through the day, all all the time. So it's something that can be taken with you. And it can improve, I like to say that my goal is to help people enhance their performance through enriching their life. So if they bring more depth to their life, and more understanding and joy and gratitude of the little things, they can be in a better place, they can be more aware, more alert, and then they can get more out of every moment. So like you said, about every practice the times when you don't have enough sleep, well you're not bringing quite as much to the practice, though. It's a little bit of an injustice to what you could have got out of the morning session if your state isn't good enough. So learning little things that sleep is a big thing, and then other little things. And it could be different for different people, but looking into the likes of mindfulness, meditation, and that's where with some of the biofeedback I like to measure and look at things I like to see, well, am I making an improvement with changes in my breathing, I was able to more than double my deep sleep on average, and reduce disruption per night. So I'm getting much better quality sleep by having done some breathing techniques. So I became a certified oxygen advantage coach, and that's something that I would use with with some players as well. A lot of people do not have 30 efficient breathing, and in current times, it's more and more important. Given the current pandemic, it is a respiratory issue or a virus that affects the respiratory system, first and foremost. And then after that, other things, but if you have a strong respiratory system, your breathing is good and efficient, you will be breathing better and your health in general will be better.

 

Fabio Molle :

And while we are on sleep here, let's say you're getting seven and a half, eight and a half hour sleep, so you're getting a good night's sleep every night from the time perspective, but from the quality, like what percentage of your sleep should be deep sleep, what should be REM sleep?

 

 

Jude O'Reilly : 

Okay, roughly 22% for each of those for REM and for deep sleep is they're pretty decent numbers to be getting. There are times that you might want either of those to be increased. And just to be careful looking at teenagers then as well their sleep needs may be increased in terms of both for time and also maybe the time that they may sleep at REM sleep tends to be predominantly later in the sleep to get most of your REM sleep. Later in the night or early in the morning, so if you have to get up early, you may well be cutting your REM sleep that night if you did have to get off to go to travel or something else. So that's something to take a little bit of care of as well. Now generally you will have what's called a REM rebound. If you are deficient one night, you will hopefully get enough or a good amount of REM the following night. But again, if you don't allow yourself the time in bed to do that. You won't get the benefit or that rebound.

 

Fabio Molle :

And I just looked at my stats here, I seem to have no problem with deep sleep. And I don't seem to have any problem with time in bed, I don't set an alarm clock in the morning, but my REM sleep, it's always a struggle with your REM sleep as in a balance in what you say, I might get a few nights where I don't get enough it comes out low on Oura and then all of a sudden there's an injection. And then it seems to be it's never like steady all night and I have looked online it's actually something that's quite hard to increase, your REM sleep.

 

Jude O'Reilly : 

Yeah, it's not as controllable as deep sleep. By physical exercise and exertion we can create within the body kind of a demand, shall we say, for the body to go into deep sleep to bring us back and to to help us recover, the REM sleep would certainly be affected by maybe alcohol and caffeine can have an effect there as well. So they are things to, to look out for. Now, not to knock alcohol, too much. We've got to have a social life and interaction and community and so on. Because those things also play a part in life in general, one glass of wine for some people may potentially help with sleep in general and give some benefit for REM, but anymore is probably going to be detrimental.

 

Fabio Molle :

You just have to try and test it.

 

Jude O'Reilly :

Exactly. So, you know, now somebody who doesn't drink. I would say stick to that as well. But to be aware that definitely there there is a very big difference and cutoff mark for most people between one and two. Some people will fool themselves and say well you know I sleep great after four or five pints, well no you just get yourself knocked out very quickly. And you don't really get much quality of sleep with that even though it may feel like you do. You have effectively been knocked out that's it.

 

Fabio Molle :

I completely agree as said it's just about two years now and I don't drink a lot but the odd time I do and I do look at the sleep and and everything and for me it's roughly one and a half drinks. After that I actually, I can feel the difference in the sleep which is kind of crazy. But so yeah, so I do think it's good to monitor these things and know what works for you and sort of know what you can nearly get away with but we have a new baby this year. I do know the importance of sleep and how you can make bad decision making, if you're not getting the right night's sleep, especially over a long time. I am going to end it with this you know, as young kids where they train really hard and are up before school, they probably going to bed late, can that be detrimental to to a career?

 

Jude O'Reilly :

It's certainly an area for care. And it's something that I would like to know more about, because I've seen where some people have been very successful by doing that. But then also what is success? How do you define success? And does it give you longevity of success? Or is it short term? And then are there other costs involved to it? So I would say better not certainly I would put emphasis on sleep and be careful how and when it's done. And I think Matthew Walker probably talks about how teenagers sleep because of their hormones and hormonal changes, and so on should be different. And we shouldn't necessarily be getting on top of them to get out of bed too early in the morning, that some of that sleep and even I think he or maybe others talk about school time should probably be shifted and starting more at 10 o'clock than eight o'clock. So I can't say definitively beyond that. Different people have different successes with different things, but I would say in general, I would be given a lot of priority to sleep. And because so much is happening that if they are studying, they will still be replaying and effectively doing revision at night while they're asleep. And the same will go for sports and if somebody is a professional athlete or we have a lot of kind of professional amateurs, almost now in certainly in the golfing world, where really they're almost doing things on a professional timeframe that they're not at school or other work or if they are doing it might be only part time, so they almost look like professionals yet they're still amateurs. I would encourage taking naps there as well. And in taking naps, it's something that some business people do as well, some very successful business people do. They may not talk about it so much talking about successful business people, probably one of the most successful in Ireland is religious about the time he would go to bed at night would be 10 or 10:30. Every night.

 

Fabio Molle : 

Can you tell us who that is?

 

Jude O'Reilly :

He's involved in the racing industry. He's not necessarily living in Ireland all the time, but I think he's Ireland's richest man.

 

Fabio Molle :

Okay, yeah. Wouldn't it wouldn't take much to figure that out. But no, I completely agree. And as you were just touching on it then, what I wanted to say was, this doesn't only apply to tennis players or sports professionals or up and coming sports stars, it applies to parents, business people, coaches, everybody, it just you can get you can get a lot more done. You can be a lot more happier if you take control of these things that we talked about before. So Jude, where can people find out more about you if they want to learn more?

 

Jude O'Reilly : 

I should update all of my social media locations but http://jude-oreilly.com is one, my website, which again that could do with some updating. Twitter is another area just again, @judeoreilly - fortunate enough to have a name that not too many other people have that I have all of those things gathered under my name. I am on Instagram, but not very active there. So Twitter or my website and my contact details, phone number and email are on the website, or I think they're probably on my Twitter account as well.

 

Fabio Molle :

Great well, and we'll include those details in the show notes. Great having you on and I always learn something more every time I talk to you. So I appreciate that. And I hope our listeners learned some interesting stuff there that will help themselves or their family members or their kids or whoever else. Thank you very much.

 

Jude O'Reilly : 

Cheers Fabio, thank you. Enjoyed having a talk.

 

Fabio Molle : 

I hope you enjoyed that episode with Jude. And you're ready to start tracking your sleep and be more mindful as again, let me know your thoughts on the episode over at the functional tennis podcast Instagram account, or over at @functennis on Twitter. Until next week, goodbye.

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